Open Source Silence Server Project! :)

[lorenzo.deluca]

hello everyone,
sorry to write in English but I am Italian and I really don't know German.
I don't know if any of you already know me, I had developed an integration for Home Assistant that integrated our scooter via the Silence API- https://github.com/lorenzo-deluca/homeassistant-silence

Since the Silecne APP will become pay-as-you-go and given the (low) quality I don't feel like paying, with another Italian guy we are working on a project (which will be open-source) that is a private server to which the Astra module will point and so we can have all the data of our scooter locally!
Also thanks to the information on this forum we have redirected the traffic to our system, which acts as a man in the middle, also redirecting the information to the Silence server, and everything works, including the commands!





what do you think?
do you think it could be a good project?
If anyone would like to join the beta tester channel, please contact me (me@lorenzodeluca.dev)
The Astra module sends a lot of information in binary, we have decoded several of them (gps data, speed, odo, temperatures, voltages), but surely there is still a lot missing.
It would be interesting to be able to extract more, as well as handle more commands... for now we handle ON/OFF/LUCI and saddle (like the app), but the module probably handles others as well..

[Pfriemler]

Hi Lorenzo,

hello everyone,
sorry to write in English but I am Italian and I really don't know German.

I love DeepL to translate my stuff, but English is welcome, too.

I don't know if any of you already know me, I had developed an integration for Home Assistant ...

Yes, you announced your project in 2021 here and user Gerold and someone else did use it.
See viewtopic.php?p=256843#p256843.
Gerold meanwhile uses his own server, I did like to use it with my SEAT Mo but the SEAT API is completely different from the Silence one (if not to say unknown), thus evcc also did not work.

what do you think? do you think it could be a good project?

It's definitly a good idea, as it opens Home Assistant applications to SEAT users. For me, I do not like any man-in-the-middle as long as this runs on a server on my own, but, as I understand, this is the final idea.

And, as I understand, redirecting the data to the Silence (input) server should work with any SEAT, too - the Astra data server is just the same.
My final interest would be to get the scooter data into my running FHEM. Dumb question: would it be possible to run a HA only to transfer the data, let's say to MQTT?
Well, best of both worlds seems to come in reach now.

The Astra module sends a lot of information in binary, we have decoded several of them (gps data, speed, odo, temperatures, voltages), but surely there is still a lot missing.

We have a lot of knowledge here how to decode data, too. See this thread: viewtopic.php?f=128&t=32163
No summary by now, sorry.

TLDR in deutsch
Lorenzo, der schon 2021 eine Home Asisstant Anbindung begonnen hat zu entwickeln (und seitdem auch hier im Forum ist), hat bisher die API der Silence-App für die Gewinnung von Daten genutzt, plant jetzt aber vor dem Hintergrund der kommenden Kostenpflicht für etliche Dienste, die Daten kurzerhand auf dem Weg zu Silence abzugreifen (und anschließend dorthin weiterzuleiten) und auf eigene Weise auszuwerten, was ähnlich wie Gerolds aktuelle Lösung funktioniert, aber das beste beider Welten bedeutet, weil die App dadurch weiterhin funktionieren würde. Damit wird diese Lösung gerade für SEAT-Fahrer interessant, die bisher keinen Zugriff auf eine API haben.

[lorenzo.deluca]

Hi Lorenzo,
I love DeepL to translate my stuff, but English is welcome, too.

yes you are right but I have noticed that the translations from German to Italian (and I suppose viceversa) are very confusing... sometimes I have trouble understanding everything you write here on the forum, writing all in English would be great!

It's definitly a good idea, as it opens Home Assistant applications to SEAT users. For me, I do not like any man-in-the-middle as long as this runs on a server on my own, but, as I understand, this is the final idea.
And, as I understand, redirecting the data to the Silence (input) server should work with any SEAT, too - the Astra data server is just the same.
My final interest would be to get the scooter data into my running FHEM. Dumb question: would it be possible to run a HA only to transfer the data, let's say to MQTT?
Well, best of both worlds seems to come in reach now.

Man-in-the-middle, or proxy mode, was intended for three main reasons:
1 - Decode commands from the app, and once understood you could even disable it.
2 - Maintain the operation of the official Silence app.
3 - (this is to be clarified) Still send status to the Silence/Seat servers so that they keep the SIM active.
We have the doubt that Silence/Seat could disable the SIM installed in the Astra module if they no longer see a scooter communicating with their servers.. do you have any information on this?

Our server communicates status and receives commands via MQTT, so it can be integrated with any system that supports MQTT. I have also integrated it with Traccar, for example.
I have a friend with the S01+ and will do some testing with his scooter as well, but I don't think there is any difference.
Have you with the Seat already verified from the Astra module logs that the communication with the Seat server is as with the Silence servers?

We have a lot of knowledge here how to decode data, too. See this thread: viewtopic.php?f=128&t=32163
No summary by now, sorry.

it would be VERY useful to write together a documentation of the communication protocol to better implement all the information. Do you think this is possible? Do you want to try asking in German?

Thanks

[patba]

Hi Lorenzo,

OK, let's continue in English. Maybe it's easier that the german people use a translation option.
As you have the project on github, maybe the best would be to do the specific discussions there (github discussions) ?
EDIT: OK, I just have realized that this on github is the HA plugin. What we are talking about here obviously will be a separate project, which then can also be acceessed from HA? But nevertheless...

I think this project is a great idea! Actually, I am also thinking about the same, but I have no experience yet with the communication of the Astra module, so I cannot contribute much at the moment. I also have no home assistant running at the moment.
May main use case is that I need access to the SOC, because I'm using evcc to control PV-guided charging. So the mqtt support is great.

My current plans were to renew the abo for one additional year and use this time to make something own. This project sounds to me to be the optimal one!

Some comments from me:

I think the "man in the middle" mode is good, because this allows full flexibility. Ideally, it should be only an option, so that the user can decide whether the data goes to Silence or not.

Gerold meanwhile uses his own server, I did like to use it with my SEAT Mo but the SEAT API is completely different from the Silence one (if not to say unknown), thus evcc also did not work.

To my information, Gerold uses openGTS (viewtopic.php?p=292324#p292324), but this is (as far as I read up to now) a huge package and it is not trivial to run it for example on a raspberry pi (need 4 GB memory). As one of our reasons to do this are the costs, one should not forget: The silence service costs 29€/year. This is not that much if you consider that a raspberry pi, consuming (let's say) 3W for 24/7, already uses electric power for abour 8€/year. Every more powerful computer would come closer to the 29€. Therefore, for me it is important to run the server in an existing evironment, in my case the raspberry pi where evcc runs.

3 - (this is to be clarified) Still send status to the Silence/Seat servers so that they keep the SIM active.
We have the doubt that Silence/Seat could disable the SIM installed in the Astra module if they no longer see a scooter communicating with their servers.. do you have any information on this?

This is an interesting point. I am wondering what happens when the free abo ends in a few weeks. Will the sim still remain active? In other words, does Silence also listen on scooters where the app has not been activated? We will see...
I think there are people here (@Gerold?) who have replaced the SIM with their own. But nobody has reported yet (to my knowledge) whether the original one stays active.

Patrick

[Pfriemler]

I decided to split the thread to a new, since ir provides a new dimension of collecting data from our scooters.

First, I dropped an important word: I do not like man-in-the-middle if it NOT runs on my Server .

Second: It is proved that the Astra firmware on both Silence and Seat is the same, even the settings are very similar, and the apn settings are the same. Both connect and deliver to a silence server, but Silence redirects SEAT VIN traffic to SEAT. As there is no other connection, the way back to scooter should go the same apn connection, thus, Silence and SEAT should work the same way with your project.

Third: we have no sure information that no traffic to silence leads to a SIM deactivation. On the other hand, there are SIM available with basic traffic for free (200 MB/month netzclub.de) which may enough for normal communication.

Fourth: I will post my parser's definition file here later with comments. Scutum S01 Reports come with a bit mask marking the included report blocks. Most of them are known in structure. I recorded the Astra serial output many times to check the function with fine results.

Last: setting up a little server with MQTT interface is highly appreciated. FHEM and MQTT are fine together. If it may run on my Raspi 3B, even better, but I would upgrade hardware if necessary

[Gerold]

I am not sending any data to the silence server since more than 3½ years but my SIM card is still active. But it is very easy as mentioned before to replace the original SIM card by your own card if the SIM will be deactivated in the future.

[lorenzo.deluca]

Thank you all for the English, also dedicated topic is better.

Regarding SIM disabling is just a doubt, now that they are going to start charging for the service I wouldn't want them to also do these checks on "dead" SIMs, maybe half scrapped and no longer connected to which they pay for a SIM for nothing.

Very interesting service netzclub.de, indeed the traffic generated is little, we can also optimized...
You know can be done even by non-German users?

For Server hosting the service is a Docker that takes up very few resources (less than 100MB of RAM), however, yes, it is required to have 24/7 hardware, a raspberry, NAS (for example actually run on a Synology), which already maybe used for something else.
It is also required to port-forward the TCP port to which the module communicates and enable Dynamic DNS if you do not have static IP from your ISP.

Technically you could also do an alternative as a service to Silence/Seat but for privacy and cyber security reasons I prefer to have everything private, let's say it's not for the user who doesn't have some technical skills.
Also connecting to the Astra module and changing the configuration is not for the ordinary user

[Pfriemler]

I wouldn't want them to also do these checks on "dead" SIMs... , maybe half scrapped and no longer connected to which they pay for a SIM for nothing.

I think this is - similar to netzclub - a cheap volume limited "pay once" SIM card with no further costs to Silence. They will kill a lot of app functions if you do not want to pay for it, but I think they are still interested in getting data of their scooters.

As netzclub may limited to German users, I am very sure that there are comparable SIM available in all countries. Do not forget: Germany's mobile Internet is one of the most expensive and poorly developed in the whole of Europe.

Docker is not that complicate, a 24/7 server, too. Users with the necessary skills to setup this should be able to drop a few command lines on a terminal connected with the Silence Astra module. The most difficult thing is to get a hardware adapter from OBD to DSub9, a serial-USB converter is cheap and available. Even a mobile phone or a tablet will work for the few modifications to do (once).

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From the Silence Connectivity Diagnostics doku: